Cracked frame!!!!

[TeXJ]

So my bolt slipped out again on my jeep which caused the wobble of death!

So as I was putting the new bolt in i noticed this...

track bar laying down, i took the bolt out of it, the nut fell off is all
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/857b34c9.jpg


hammer is there for a size comparison...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/f66138e9.jpg

sorry for the fuzz
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/952e943b.jpg

[TeXJ]

The other really is fuzzy but you can see the crack. Here's an image for the vision impaired :D

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/f66138e9-1.jpg

[XJ4IV]

donner dude that sucks, Id get some plate and go from the bumper plate back past the coil bucket area and weld it in, it will give you LOTS of strength to did you ever see joes frame breakage? believe it or not it was WAY worse

[XJ4IV]

I guess I need to go check my jeep really closely this week prior to kickin along with the 60's Im not positive other than plate it a perfect repair I just know welding on frames is scary work

[TeXJ]

Yeah I'm thinking just weld the crack, then weld plate over it

[bluedragon436]

Yeah that def. doesn't look good.. but I'm sure it is very easily taken care of.. well easy for folks that know how to weld that is!!

[XJ4IV]

eh theres people that weld then theres people that can melt metal together

[TeXJ]

I cant do either :(

[XJ4IV]

SURE YA CAN... just get a welder if you can draw you can melt metal LOL that lincoln I have is only 290 brand new and that thing will do ANYTHING you need for your jeep

[TeXJ]

yeah about that, I dont want my learning to start on my frame lol

[4.3LXJ]

That is not so bad. It can be fixed. It just needs to be welded. How much effort you want to put into it is up to you. I could have it fixed in under an hour, including unbolting and rebolting the track bar to get it out of the way. Basically I would weld the crack with a wire feed welder. That plate that is there is a reinforcing plate that is spot welded to the frame to strengthen it there where the track bar mount bolts on. After welding the crack, I would weld all around the plate making it more than spot welds holding it on. Then reattach the track bar. Or if you wanted to take longer you could get that plate off, which would be a pain, then weld the crack and then weld a new plate in there. You could also plate the web of the frame also. That area takes a lot of stress when wheeling. I plated mine when I made my new track bar set up.

[TeXJ]

thats a good idea about just welding the existing plate there.

[bigjim350]

I agree with steve. Dont try to weld it with a stick welder. Unless you are very good at welding you will burn holes in the frame and be worse off with a stick welder.

[Showtime3492]

I agree with using a MIG welder if you have access but could be done with a stick just make sure when you do weld it you sand off the paint and groove the crack out just a little bit to make sure the weld penetrates well because it is 2 fold sheet metal there and it may have cracked through both layers. When done don't grind the weld off totally and spray a coat of primer over the weld and heat affected zone before plating it. I recommend using 1/8 inch to 3/16 plate.

[LizardRunner]

for welding of that sort, MIG is best, with a stick type welder you would really want the stitch welder attachment from Eastwood. http://www.eastwood.com/spot-and-stitch-welder-set-with-rods.html

[TeXJ]

I cant weld so I wont be able to do any of it, and I dont think this is something to learn on lol

[steph74]

or you play McGuyver style and use a piece of gum, shove it in the crack and use the wrapper over it to make it disappear... then put a sticker and be done with it ;)


Sorry just kidding... good luck with that

[xj4life2]

That is not so bad. It can be fixed. It just needs to be welded. How much effort you want to put into it is up to you. I could have it fixed in under an hour, including unbolting and rebolting the track bar to get it out of the way. Basically I would weld the crack with a wire feed welder. That plate that is there is a reinforcing plate that is spot welded to the frame to strengthen it there where the track bar mount bolts on. After welding the crack, I would weld all around the plate making it more than spot welds holding it on. Then reattach the track bar. Or if you wanted to take longer you could get that plate off, which would be a pain, then weld the crack and then weld a new plate in there. You could also plate the web of the frame also. That area takes a lot of stress when wheeling. I plated mine when I made my new track bar set up.

times 2 on the red highlighted area

[TeXJ]

times 2 on the red highlighted area

do you have any pics of what was done?

[4.3LXJ]

I am assuming you mean me there. I made a new track bar and bracket. Here is the only pic I have right now.

http://i649.photobucket.com/albums/uu215/warriorsuspension/IMG_1303.jpg

This is not the average replacement track bar. But you can see I included a plate that goes all the way from my winch bumper mount to about midway behind the coil. There is another welded on the bottom as well as bolted in the OEM places. One thing to consider is bracing your track bar mount. To get an idea, go to Iron Man Andys site and look at his deluxe track bar set up. It braces to the other side of the frame also, something I will do another time. But for right now my mount is as solid as can be.

[TeXJ]

My track bar
http://www.tntcustoms.com/droptrackbarbracketxj.aspx

thanks 4.3, I was meaning anybody that had a pic, but I like them all! :D

I couldnt find Ironman's trackbar mount like you had describe, must not sell it now?

[4.3LXJ]

I think Tony bought one

[DETOURS]

Prior to welding that crack, and after the area's been cleaned up......a 3/16" hole should be drilled at the end of the crack, then welded.

This is common practice for 'crack' repairs of all sorts.

[TeXJ]

Prior to welding that crack, and after the area's been cleaned up......a 3/16" hole should be drilled at the end of the crack, then welded.

This is common practice for 'crack' repairs of all sorts.

Like this?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/f66138e9-2.jpg

[DETOURS]

At either end of the crack, yes.......if the crack ends at the open end of a pcs of steel, the open end is not required.

Example, Brush Hog motor plate, cracked/fatigued......
Cracks have been grooved, in this case a 1/8" hole drilled at most ends-

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v649/Detours/WHEELER001.jpg

Further prep for welding-

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v649/Detours/WHEELER002.jpg

Weld-

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v649/Detours/WHEELER003.jpg

Grind smooth when completed....

[bluedragon436]

I cant do either :(

Me either!! Don't feel bad TeXJ!! I do plan however to pick up a decent beginner welder, and start playing with some scrap metal.. but I also don't think I would want to start welding on my frame or suspension parts!!

[DETOURS]

It's easier to learn on a decent welder, not a beginner......the hotter the better!

[bluedragon436]

Yeah kind of what I figured too Mark.. just don't think I can justify spending the higher money with the wife for something I haven't even learned yet... otherwise I would much rather have a decent welder to "grow into" so to speak!! I don't know.. not in too big of a rush.. so I'll keep my eye peeled for a deal on CL if I don't purchase a new decent welder first..

[Showtime3492]

My track bar
http://www.tntcustoms.com/droptrackbarbracketxj.aspx

thanks 4.3, I was meaning anybody that had a pic, but I like them all! :D

I couldnt find Ironman's trackbar mount like you had describe, must not sell it now?

The ironman 4x4 trac bar mount uses the factory mount drilled out to 3/4 and then a double shear end is bolted to the factory mount. But he doesnt offer a whole new bracket like IRO or any other double shear company does. I run his double shear track bar and love the thing.

[DETOURS]

Yeah kind of what I figured too Mark.. just don't think I can justify spending the higher money with the wife for something I haven't even learned yet... otherwise I would much rather have a decent welder to "grow into" so to speak!! I don't know.. not in too big of a rush.. so I'll keep my eye peeled for a deal on CL if I don't purchase a new decent welder first..


Dont fear an older 220 Miller/Hobart or Lincoln....or HTP.
If they can't show you that it runs & welds.......walk away.......;)

You can turn down the heat on a hotter welder.......tinnie bopper bubble gum welders can only be turned up so far....... Thats justification right there, you'll also always get your money back if purchased correctly.

[bluedragon436]

I will def. keep this in mind when I start looking to pick up a welder.. and will def. keep the heads up about show-n-tell if I go to look at a used one from CL... I def. don't want to waste my money on something that not only can I not make full use of just starting out.. but doesn't work in the first place... def. think the wife would frown upon that!!

[BlueXJ]

My frame had no cracks but I plated the rails with a set of TnT frame stiffeners followed by rock sliders. All welded with a Miller 180 autoset welder. I learned to weld 50 years ago with a Lincoln stick welder the principles all still apply. If you learn on a old stick with some thicker scrap then a wire feed will be like riding a bike. YOU CAN DO IT!!!!

[4.3LXJ]

That is a good point. My used 220V MIG is still worth what I paid for it.

[bluedragon436]

Yeah I found a decent welder last night... and it was right down the road from my house too... but the guy had just sold it.. oh well.. not meant to be...

[TeXJ]

Thanks for the pics!

I'll see about getting somebody to help me out.

[jeepxj95]

and post back when u get it fix and pix to show what u did

[saar]

Prior to welding that crack, and after the area's been cleaned up......a 3/16" hole should be drilled at the end of the crack, then welded.

This is common practice for 'crack' repairs of all sorts.

+1 for that.
Besides that, learn how to use the welder and try it on some metal pieces around, only after you control it fix the frame. don't rush into it....
Saar

[TeXJ]

I'll post pics of the before and after, I just need to get somebody that can weld it I have a few friends in mind.

SCOTTERS why did you have to leave me!!

Whats funny is that you had your welder at the house the whole time and we never needed it lol

[LizardRunner]

Glad you have some buddies to do the welding. I'm planning for my new welder, an HTP unit. Any time I weld, I do some practice pieces before going to the actual job. That way I know I'm in the rythm to lay down some good beads with full penetration. About the only way I wouldn't do practice pieces was if I had a shop where I did some welding every day.

[bluedragon436]

Looking forward to seeing the outcome of this fix... I know it is fairly easy fix, for someone with a welder and the knowledge to use it...

[XJ4IV]

I'll post pics of the before and after, I just need to get somebody that can weld it I have a few friends in mind.

SCOTTERS why did you have to leave me!!

Whats funny is that you had your welder at the house the whole time and we never needed it lol

im sorry dude... I wish I was there ... but seriously I dont think I could ever give up this house!

[Showtime3492]

Just a thought... Maybe find a local muffler shop or somethin that has a welder and see if you can just hook someone up with a few bucks or a case of beer to weld it up for ya.

[TeXJ]

Didnt know this but a guy at church has a business where they build the handicap vans for people. He said I could bring it over there and they have metal and welders and such and I could get it done there for free :D

He has a sammie that he is wanting to fix up. I just need to get my bushing project done. Bushing is in just need an extra hand to get the upper control arm back in alignment as well as the trackbar...

[TeXJ]

So got it fixed and here are some pics:

prep, grinding and drilling:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/047.jpg

opened up the crack for a better weld:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/050.jpg

The machine:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/051.jpg

So the "frame" was separating. Pulling it back together:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/054.jpg

more clampage:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/056.jpg

welded
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/057.jpg

[TeXJ]

grinding;
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/061.jpg

grounded...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/062.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/063.jpg

welding some metal for support
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/067.jpg

some more welding of extra metal!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/068.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/070.jpg

[TeXJ]

before paint
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/073.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/074.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v698/TeXJ2424/075.jpg

[4.3LXJ]

There, not so bad was it? Only a small pain in the :ass:

[TeXJ]

There, not so bad was it? Only a small pain in the :ass:

Finding somebody that has the knowledge/skills was the hard part :D

[XJ4IV]

Donner Id honestly plate that WHOLE "frame" I didnt realize how small the bumper mounts were on that thing.. those ONLY use two of the three steering brace bolts!
I could work some magic for ya but it would need to be with me for a couple weeks.. you might wanna get the jetta back :eek:

[bluedragon436]

Glad to see you were able to get it taken care of... I would def. talk to them and see if you can't talk them into doing some more plating for you.. might as well get as much as you can plated as cheap as possible... or even better free!!..

[TeXJ]

Ok i'll see about getting some more metal. Scotters ya know the jetta is looonngg gone :( but I'm glad to see it go the way of the dodo bird :D

[XJ4IV]

yeah guess what I saw today... our durangos replacement...I think its an RT concept...
either way Ive fallen in love all over again with...http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRGC7Sshf5b4iCMJwC8Wg6EMMm7P5a0M 3CTg2_JKjbc5t2K7GVnww

[Showtime3492]

I really dont wanna rain on this parade... but while this guy still has it fresh in his mind that he helped you i would take a flashlight if you havent already and look very cloesly around the steering box holes and look for any stress fractures from the previous damage thats now repaired. overall though if not thats awesome and maybe just invest in a C-rock steering box brace or jcr somethin like that.

[TeXJ]

I really dont wanna rain on this parade... but while this guy still has it fresh in his mind that he helped you i would take a flashlight if you havent already and look very cloesly around the steering box holes and look for any stress fractures from the previous damage thats now repaired. overall though if not thats awesome and maybe just invest in a C-rock steering box brace or jcr somethin like that.

Yeah I figured I'd get the brace that replace the lil brace/spacer job, and just keep an eye out for more cracks. two of the bolts for the steering box were a lil loose so that didnt help much either. There is now now play in the "frame" around the steering...steering components on the other hand....

[Showtime3492]

Yeah I figured I'd get the brace that replace the lil brace/spacer job, and just keep an eye out for more cracks. two of the bolts for the steering box were a lil loose so that didnt help much either. There is now now play in the "frame" around the steering...steering components on the other hand....

Ok thats good mostly bolt on stuff is much easier so i would definetly get a brace for the inside. Good to see it mostly fixed up though.

[4.3LXJ]

Get yourself some plate and plate it all the way back. That will save you any future grief.

[TeXJ]

Get yourself some plate and plate it all the way back. That will save you any future grief.

How much plating are ya talking about? any pics?

[Showtime3492]

How much plating are ya talking about? any pics?

Check out tnt customs unibody rail reinforcing setup that shoukd give you a good idea of the stress areas. But ideally plate the whole front cuz that's where the xj takes a beating.

[tiny43]

yikes im checking mine too