Building a custom lift---- Anyone want to help????

[TheWeiss]

I am, finally, ready to get Lift my XJ and get some big tires under it. Through years of living in the Jeep world (and hiding my relatively stock suspension from real Jeppers) I have aquired some materials for this lift. For the rest of the necessary supplies and I ok with buying new and/ or hitting the junk yard (treasure trove as I see it). First here's what we're starting with

'96 XJ Sport 30 inch tires
Up Front : JKS ACOS (adjustable Coil Over Spacers) - These provide about 1.75 inches of lift at their lowest setting but are adjustable a good amount taller

Out back: "Heavy Duty" leaf springs that are supposed to be 1 inch taller than stock (they've sagged a little)


Now here are the supplies I have happened upon:
Teraflex 4 inch lifted front springs
Bump stop spacers
Skyjacker transfer case lowering kit (brackets)
Teraflex lower control arms (not long arms)


Now here's what I know I'll need:
Up Front:
Dropped Pitman arm (maybe out of a ZJ? Will it drop enough?)
Shocks (will have to be new)
Adjustable Track Bar
Extended sway bar links?
Upper Control Arms?
Extender brake lines?

In the Rear:
AAL's or new Springs
Rear Shackles (From and MJ?)
Extended break lines (out of a Durango or S10?)
Longer U bolts


This is going to be a project in the making for quite a while but I'm excited to do it and excited to hear what advise and suggestions you guys have to offer.

[4.3LXJ]

If you run a dropped pitman arm you will need to also lower the same end of the trac bar or you will have some bump steer.

[lil_red_wagon]

whats your goal on lift size?

front brake lines all you need to do is unbolt the hard line and bend it down. im runnin 6" lift and this worked fine for me. also the tj front lines will extend some too.

zj or wj rear brakeline will work just fine thats what i have as well as a few friends.

if you add the second and third leafs from a k5 blazer leaf pack you will get about 3" to 3.5" of lift and will ride and flex real well(i know from experience its what i have).

shocks on the rear: 98 s10 rear shocks will work you will just need to change out the bar pins. from yours to the s10 ones. here is autozones part number 81482 will work for around 4 to 6" of lift

dependin on lift you wont need to do upper arms.

i will post more later

[TheWeiss]

I'm thinking that because I have the 4 inch springs and the ACOS up front giving me 1.75 inches at a minimum I'm looking to settle right around 6 inches.

Also worth mentioning, I currently have the Chrystler 8.25 rear end with the 27 spline axels. This is going to need to be changed out if I want to turn tires worth wheeling. I'm thinking that I might want to do this at the same time as the lift. I would welcome suggestions for junk yard read end that will pop on "relatively" easily with or without a bracket kit. I plan to do the rear first and the front later on. Can this be done? Or will it be a significantly more adventageous to do both at the same time?

[4.3LXJ]

If you are headed for six inches, you had better plan on long arms or control arm drop brackets. You can't do that much on short arms alone. If you did manage it you would have a terrible ride and guaranteed death wobble due to positive castor angle. There is no real cheap way to get that much lift. Also plan on an slip yoke eliminator. The rear driveline will not take that much angle.

[lil_red_wagon]

as for 6" lift i ran stock control arms for a while on it. now i have short arms. i also know a good number of xj's with short arms with 6" lift. it can be done without probs. i do agree with the sye. i installed min and it helped alot. also when you do a sye you need to correct the pinion angle for the sye. i would also recommend doin some sort of cross over steering. as for the rear you could always do a 29 spline upgrade to be strong enough. i have seen many 29 splines run 35" tires with no prob. or you could swap out to a ford explorer 8.8. i also recommend changin your gears to match with the tires.

[BlueXJ]

You may be able to get by with short arms but the ride will suffer and the geometry of your front axle will be way off. Long arms will make a big difference.

[Mudderoy]

How bad is the "ride". Maybe I suffer from never owning an expensive lift, but the two 4x4s that I have had were both ruff riding. I mean the first one was a truck, so by it's nature it rode ruff. I look at it that as long as your fillings (and teeth) stay in how smooth does the ride have to be. I mean if I want a smooth ride I can get a car, right?

Not trying to poke anyone with a stick, :poke: I am just trying to understand this quality of ride importance.

Please don't confuse this with "why long arms". I like them and I'm going to have me some, some day.

[4.3LXJ]

Once you get a steep angle on the lower control arms, the amount of force transfered to the frame is proportional to the sine of the angle from the frame. OK, Mud understands that, but just for instance if you have a 30 degree angle, that comes out to half. So the springs and shocks don't absorb the energy. At 45 degrees it is 70%

[BlueXJ]

The short arms tend to move a great distance with each up and down movement of the front axle. Which translates into a lot of movement over every bump. Whereas the long arms have a smoother arc to travel in thus a smoother overall ride and not a jerky one suchas that on a short arm with such a long travel for each small movement. It is the acute angles which the short arms are forced into on their travle arcs in their articulation with the rearmost frame mounts.
Did you see the "Trucks" episode where they upgraded to long arms? They showed the differences in short arm and long arm articulation and the geometric differences. That is the basis for my statements above.

[Mudderoy]

Once you get a steep angle on the lower control arms, the amount of force transfered to the frame is proportional to the sine of the angle from the frame. OK, Mud understands that, but just for instance if you have a 30 degree angle, that comes out to half. So the springs and shocks don't absorb the energy. At 45 degrees it is 70%


The short arms tend to move a great distance with each up and down movement of the front axle. Which translates into a lot of movement over every bump. Whereas the long arms have a smoother arc to travel in thus a smoother overall ride and not a jerky one suchas that on a short arm with such a long travel for each small movement. It is the acute angles which the short arms are forced into on their travle arcs in their articulation with the rearmost frame mounts.
Did you see the "Trucks" episode where they upgraded to long arms? They showed the differences in short arm and long arm articulation and the geometric differences. That is the basis for my statements above.

Hey thanks, I understood that long arms smooth things out because of the angle and more movement of the axle required than on short arms to cause the same effect, the thing I was asking about is why are so many people concerned about ride quality? Do you guys have bad backs? Hit your head on the roof of the vehicle? Maybe is the woman that don't like it, and we all like to have our women with us from time to time. :thumbsup: :D

I remember when I had a 1985 Cougar. It was so smooth and comfortable that it was like driving a bed to work, but I'd rather have my Jeep! I mean ruff ride is just how it is when you drive a manly vehicle.

What am I missing here?

[BlueXJ]

I want some comfort in my daily driver as well as my wife. Maybe my aged body or my arthritis but a smoother ride is more important as I age. If I want a rough ride I just need to increase my spring rate to a 1 ton set of springs to achieve that. It would be live a solid mounted axle with no spring travel, thus my ride would then be determined by the surface of the roadway and not my vehicle's suspension.

[4.3LXJ]

If you have an XJ, by definition it will not ride like an old Caddy. There is some reasonable in between. When I was designing and marketing lift kits in the late 70s a harsh ride was expected. But now with longer travel suspensions and larger tires, what we used to do then is just child's play now. The standards have also changed for pickups too. We have come to expect the farm truck to ride like the family sedan and still carry a load. It is a lot tougher now to fill the bill than it used to be. But I do appreciate a moderate ride.

[TheWeiss]

How easy is it to go long arm in a piece by piece lift? Would it just be a matter of getting a cross member and some long arms? If so, can you purchase them seperate from full kits?

I'm finding myself wondering if the right path might just be buying a full 5.5 or 6 inch lift and selling my aquired parts.

Also, from everything I've read you guys are all on point the SYE. Is an SYE something I could do to the Jeep pre lift?

[Mudderoy]

How easy is it to go long arm in a piece by piece lift? Would it just be a matter of getting a cross member and some long arms? If so, can you purchase them seperate from full kits?

I'm finding myself wondering if the right path might just be buying a full 5.5 or 6 inch lift and selling my aquired parts.

Also, from everything I've read you guys are all on point the SYE. Is an SYE something I could do to the Jeep pre lift?

I'll answer the last one. You can absolutely go with the SYE first. In fact many people recommend that. When you lift an XJ you never know if it will have vibrations or not. You find out after the lift. Doing the SYE first is the correct way to go.

[4.3LXJ]

How easy is it to go long arm in a piece by piece lift? Would it just be a matter of getting a cross member and some long arms? If so, can you purchase them seperate from full kits?

I'm finding myself wondering if the right path might just be buying a full 5.5 or 6 inch lift and selling my aquired parts.

Also, from everything I've read you guys are all on point the SYE. Is an SYE something I could do to the Jeep pre lift?

Yes, you can do your SYE prior to lift. But, I want to qualify that in that the higher the lift, the longer the drive line needs to be. Not by much, but some. The best thing to do here is call Tom Woods Driveline and ask them. They have it figured out for each lift. The other route is that many use a Hack and Tap which is cheap and a used front drive shaft. Seems to work OK. If you put in a SYE prior to lift, you will still have to shim your rear end so the driveline looks like this.

http://i649.photobucket.com/albums/uu215/warriorsuspension/cv_angle.gif

[BlueXJ]

Tom Woods can also tell you what degree shims to purchase for each lift height.