Wobble Back

[apw5746]

I got my Jeep Mar 2011- 150,922. Previous owner contacted after I got from stealership. He indicated he had a slight front left tap to wife's car.

Like most owners I had the dreaded death wobble (38-45 mph). I've put 4 new BF Goodrich All Terrain T/A tires, new track bar, replaced all shocks, all ball joints, hubs, brakes, power steering box, steering stabilizer, front rotors, rear leafs, put bushings in front sway bar links, changed all fluids, and did major tune up. Front end was realigned after each major change. Did all this in first 2500 miles. Also had tie rods checked, and were okay. At 166,918 replaced all shocks as fronts were leaking (warranty covered replacement). Left upper/lower ball joints crapped out & replaced at 178,950. Front axle u-joints done at same time, and realigned.

Wobble is back (179,500). Starts around 49-52 and smooths out afterwards. This is a stock 99 XJ. I don't rock crawl, go mudding, only off road is to find an out of way fly fishing spot, and go gold prospecting.

I'm at my breaking point. Plus this is my DD and only vehicle, so I can't afford to have it down while repairs are done. I'm thinking this slight tap was harder than originally told. Does a shop have to determine if something in front is bent?

If all bushings in front suspension are replaced, along with 4 new control arms, and tie rods, should it handle better? I realize some changes only mask problem.

I know it's not the Toyota's, and Subaru's I used to drive, and won't be smooth driving, but it shouldn't wobble and shake either.

Anyone live near Colorado Springs, who know's XJ well? Just Empty Every Pocket - JEEP is breaking my pocket book!

Bottom line is I need good, solid advice. Especially from seasoned owners.

Pat

[4.3LXJ]

Pat, the first thing to do for this is to have someone saw the steering wheel back and forth while you look underneath at the steering linkage, track bar etc. See if there is any movement at any of the joints. If there is, that is probably the culprit. Stock rigs usually are harder to make wobble than our lifted rigs.

[NW99XJ]

Pat, the first thing to do for this is to have someone saw the steering wheel back and forth while you look underneath at the steering linkage, track bar etc. See if there is any movement at any of the joints. If there is, that is probably the culprit. Stock rigs usually are harder to make wobble than our lifted rigs.
Matt over at Bleepin Jeep has made a couple vids that do a good job of illustrating how to identify death wobble issues, and how to fix them.
http://youtu.be/gVJx8buTE8I

[NW99XJ]

My own death wobble way back when was caused by the track bar bushing going bad at the axle side....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIFRXETADBA

[XJ Wheeler]

I used to live near there but sadly not anymore so i can't help personally. But i can suggest two shops. Predator Off Road in the springs and Vahsholtz Auto in woodland. Use to know both shops owners and they're good people.

Sent via messenger pigeon - i talk, he types.

[apw5746]

I want to add to my first post. Something happened today that really has me baffled. Especially since I'm a retired paper pusher.

Bought 15 bags of 2CU ft mulch and had it loaded in the back of the Jeep. Each bag weighed about 18-20 lbs. So I had between 270-300 lbs over the back axel. Noticed on the drive home that car rode pretty darn good as compared to driving it dry. I even drove over some of the same roads that have made it shake, rattle, and roll lately.

Does this mean I need to put an 1/8th ton of sand bags in the back to get a good ride?

NW99XJ - I've looked at videos Matt has on death wobble. Even sent him an email similar to my post. He feels I just might have something bent.

XJ Wheeler - I know of both shops. Have had some dealings with both, but not about this subject. Will contact Vahsholtz first. Their near the Western Gas Station aren't they?

4.3LXJ - had my neighbor do this very thing, but I really couldn't tell much. Nothing moved like my shot ball joints did though.

I know parts wear out and some are bad to begin with (shocks as an example). Can track bar bushings go bad this fast? I'd love it to be that simple.

Honestly, if I had the money, and wasn't separated, I'd have a Toyota or another Subaru in a heart beat. I'd keep the Jeep though, cause I can't stand defeat.

Thanks all.

Pat

[Joliet Johnny]

Ok, adding 270-300lbs to the rear fixed it if Im reading right? Doing that should have noticeably sank your rear end? Id wonder if there was a problem in your rear driveshaft or axle? But pulling more weight would put more stress on your engine/transmission/transfer case too. Im wanting to blame the ujoints in the driveshaft which may be original and bad anyways?

[slvmart]

IMO, it's much more likely that the weight shift (of the load in back) caused a change in alignment and (un)loading on some of the front end components. It's probably a pain, but if you could compare the front end with and without the load, it might be revealing.

[XJ Wheeler]

XJ Wheeler - I know of both shops. Have had some dealings with both, but not about this subject. Will contact Vahsholtz first. Their near the Western Gas Station aren't they?



My apologies but I haven't been there in several years so I can't reliably comment on their location as they have moved since then. But in searching it looks to be behind the Safeway on Loop.

[Cheromaniac]

Bought 15 bags of 2CU ft mulch and had it loaded in the back of the Jeep. Each bag weighed about 18-20 lbs. So I had between 270-300 lbs over the back axel. Noticed on the drive home that car rode pretty darn good as compared to driving it dry. I even drove over some of the same roads that have made it shake, rattle, and roll lately.

I also made the same observation in my XJ from the outset when I bought it almost 19 years ago (now just crossed 250k miles). When I'm carrying some cargo in the rear (or extra passengers), not only does the ride improve but when I'm driving on a gravel road, traction is improved and I don't need to use 4-Hi to keep going in a straight line without fishtailing. I think the reason is that the XJ has more front weight bias and is lightweight at the rear.


Can track bar bushings go bad this fast? I'd love it to be that simple.


They shouldn't go bad that quickly but you never know. Even if the bushing at the axle end is OK, the ball joint at the body mount could be worn and it's sometimes difficult to diagnose it.
I recently had the same problem and I was only able to make that diagnosis when the ball joint was worn enough to make a clunking sound upon turning the steering wheel. Sure enough when I asked a buddy to turn the wheel while I was looking underneath, I could see right away where the problem was and I replaced the track bar afterwards.

[4.3LXJ]

Since the load fixed the wobble, my questions are:

Are you sure the wobble or vibration is in the front? Does the steering wheel shake?

Is it a slow vibration or very fast?

When was the last time your shocks were changed?

Is that track bar bushing bolt hole round or egg shaped/

[apw5746]

4.3 LXJ - Shocks changed in Jan 2012. Yes the wobble is felt in the steering wheel.

Once I start to hit 51 mph, front end shakes. Not violently, but enough that, if I had a passenger seat, the passenger would feel it, and wonder what the heck is happening. I try to avoid pot holes, and make it a habit of going slowly over speed bumps. Changes in road surface affects all vehicles to some degree - right?

I haven't gone underneath and looked at the track bar bushing that goes into the bracket under the passenger side (I'm assuming that the bushing you mean).

Do all of you feel the track bar bushing replaced only, or get a new track bar? Again, I assume you all would try the bushing first.

Pat

[4.3LXJ]

There are two things that could cause the wobble in this area. One is the bushing itself. Yes it can be changed without replacing the whole bar. The second is the hole the bolt goes through being slightly oval. It needs to be as tight in there as possible. I fixed my son's TJ, which has identical parts, which had a slight wobble due to the hole being slightly loose. Not a real easy fix, requires welding, but is doable. Also, does your steering box need adjustment?

[apw5746]

There are two things that could cause the wobble in this area. One is the bushing itself. Yes it can be changed without replacing the whole bar. The second is the hole the bolt goes through being slightly oval. It needs to be as tight in there as possible. I fixed my son's TJ, which has identical parts, which had a slight wobble due to the hole being slightly loose. Not a real easy fix, requires welding, but is doable. Also, does your steering box need adjustment?

I'm not sure if the steering box needs adjustment, but I got a spacer for it from JCROffroad to replace the flimsy stock one. Bleepin Jeep shows it in one of his videos. When I replace it, I'll look at the track bar. I'm not a welder, so I hope it's an easy fix. When I replaced the ball joints, I was told that the steering box was loose, but I'm not sure if that's what you're referring to.

With what you describing, I feel more than a days worth of down time.

[apw5746]

Several additional questions.

1. How do you tell if u-joints on drive shafts are going bad. Visual inspection?

2. Since it's a unibody frame, can a frame shop only determine if it's straight or bent?

3. Which is a better bushing for track bar, and why. One or two piece.

4. Besides many, how many bushings are there to the front suspension?

Aside from #2 having to be done by a shop, are the rest doable at an auto hobby shop.

[4.3LXJ]

1. Yes, visual inspection, but sometimes you have to take the joints out and try to flex them by hand

2. Yes

3. One piece

4. 5

[apw5746]

1. Yes, visual inspection, but sometimes you have to take the joints out and try to flex them by hand

2. Yes

3. One piece

4. 5

Only 5 bushings? Where?

[4.3LXJ]

5 on the axle. There are 4 on the other ends of the control arms