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View Full Version : I was a guest of the judicial system today.



Mudderoy
08-21-2012, 02:11 PM
I spent four hours in traffic court this morning.

370

When I received my speeding ticket back in May(?) I was surprised that I received it then I was surprised it was for 52 in a 40. When I told the officer I was told by my CHL instructor (concealed Handgun License) that the police didn't give traffic tickets to CHL holders, he was surprised and said he had never heard of that. Then he told me, I never show up to court. For a half second I thought "well good for you" but then it dawned on me what he was telling me.

So today was the day of the court date. I had gone before, back in June, to set a court date, for today.

I showed up on time at 8am. Wrong! You can show up and 9am without worry.

There is NO judge present until the afternoon. So what they do is have you talk to one of the three assistant district attorneys to reach a settlement, solution, etc...

The place was packed. By 9:45am I was sitting in the special seats waiting for my turn to speak to a D.A. My name was called the guy was really nice and he just wanted to help me get back to my life, work, whatever.

I told him I wanted the ticket dismissed. I told him why. I started with the citation that was printed on thermal paper, and it was illegible! Then I told him I was surrounded by other vehicles all doing the same speed I was and IF the laser actually struck any part of my vehicle it had to be above the hood which meant that the returning laser light would have been angled up in the air and not back to the gun.

I was within 100 feet of the 40 mph speed limit sign (a change from 45 mph), and was in the process of slowing down, safely as not to cause an accident with the cars following just behind me. Plus I was in a turn, which meant my relative speed to the stationary officer was constantly changing.

So being the great guy he was he was able to offer me a $50 fine, $103 in court costs, and 90 day deferred adjudication. So keep my nose clean, so to speak, for 3 months and nothing goes on my record. It was still going to cost me $153 though, and then I ran the risk of getting another ticket.

I told him I was fine with the $$$ but the 90 day thing I didn't care for. He said the 90 days was the least the judge would allow them to do. So then I played the missing cop card. He turned to the other DA, interrupting him from his defendant and asked if {insert name here} officer was there today. The other DA says "Oh yeah, he's here!" lol so now we're playing poker, okay.

I told the DA I didn't want to waste anyone's time but if I needed to go in front of a jury, okay. He said he could call the officer, hmmm why he's there isn't he?, and see if he remembers me and my ticket. He told me it might be an hour or longer. I agreed, and said if he remembers then we can do the jury trial, right?

So I went and sat. Sure they were waiting for me to watch that clock for a little while and cave in. Screw it, I'll take my chances with the jury! I've watched Matlock, LA Law, Judge Judy! I can do this!

Shortly after receiving my ticket letters from attorneys started showing up in the mail. For $50 the promised I wouldn't have to pay the fine. As my four hour stay progressed I was learning. Learning from listening to when the attorneys that people had hired were talking to their clients.

I was a little nervous about the call to the cop until I over heard another defendant asking his attorney what was going on. The attorney said they were going call the officer, so it might be another 30 minutes, but he should wait and see what the officer said. The man sat down. I just got a free bit of legal advice!

The court room was really clearing out. There was a big early waive of dismissals. Then one by one people would get paperwork, I suspect for defensive driving, and others were directed down the hall to pay their ticket. I'm sure it was that great $50 deal!

Finally there were 9 people left in the once completely filled and spilling out into the hall court room. Easily 200 people, perhaps 300.

One of the defense attorneys stood up and started calling people's names. All his clients as it turned out. He said, if I called your name your ticket has been dismissed. I even heard one guy say "best fifty dollars I ever spent!"

About this time the clerk called the 8th person, who wasn't there with an attorney, and I heard her telling him his case had been dismissed.

Then she called my name. Would I be the LONE person that was to wait for the jury trial at 1pm(ish). You know when the judge was there, and one of the asst. DA would have to try and win the verdict from the jury of 6 of my peers? Hell no! That would be crazy! Case dismissed!

In my opinion it was the goal of that court to get as many people processed in a short of an amount of time as possible (certainly before lunch). Get as many people to pay the fees and fines as possible and let the rest slip through with defensive driving. Anyone digging their heals in, dismiss.

I'm not bitter about going, I'm not bitter about having my ticket dismissed, I'm bitter about what I learned, and of course long suspected.

Tickets aren't about keep the public safe they are about collecting revenue for the state. The speed I was traveling wasn't unsafe as I was going with the flow of traffic. Was I speeding, yes. Was I going as fast as they said, no.

The court people were very nice and no one had that typical government worker shitty attitude, but how they are trying to work people is wrong.

So that group of 7 people with the one attorney, that was $350 worth of income for him that day, but I wasn't one of the ones that paid.

OrangeXJ
08-21-2012, 05:44 PM
It's all a money game they would have spent well over the 153 thay offered they were hopeing you would pay and leave

Tickets are money makers for the city. I know several HPD officers and they are required to write at least 5 tickets a day

4.3LXJ
08-21-2012, 05:51 PM
It is a money game anywhere. Here they don't even investigate burglaries, theft until it goes to five figures, embezzlement until six figures and a number of other crimes. You full out a form for their stats. However there are plenty of popos for traffic.

UpstateXJ
08-21-2012, 06:11 PM
I have had tickets get dismissed after requesting a jury trial. I haven't ever had an officer/trooper not show up to court though. For some odd reason they always make it lol

cantab27
08-21-2012, 10:51 PM
wow...get a ticket here ya pay ...faster ya go the bigger the $ ya pay....

oderdene
08-22-2012, 12:08 AM
once read, in Finland, ticket amount based on yearly income of driver. if Nokia boss get ticket, it will be few thousands :D :D :D

bigjim350
08-22-2012, 12:14 AM
You break the law, you get caught, you should pay the price...simple.

4.3LXJ
08-22-2012, 12:42 AM
once read, in Finland, ticket amount based on yearly income of driver. if Nokia boss get ticket, it will be few thousands :D :D :D

That is correct. Based on ability to pay

Carves
08-22-2012, 12:48 AM
You break the law, you get caught, you should pay the price...simple.


So true ... :thumbsup:


... but down here traffic fines are a primary form of govt funding rather than being bad driving deterrents.


So the system is quite happy to nail you for driving at just a coupla mile over the posted limit ... and the favourite speed monitoring points ... are at the bottom of a hill ...

... coz they know people would rather do 37mph or so in a 35mph rather than unnescessarily wearing out brake pads maintaining 35mph ... :bang:

... and try over taking a truck you've been stuck behind ... for half an hour or more on our one-lane highways ... can almost guarantee thats when the highway patrol will pop out from behind a bush ... and ping ya for doing 65 in 60 zone .. :rolleyes:

bigjim350
08-22-2012, 12:50 AM
I got a speeding ticket about a month ago, which I WILL be paying. Was on a back country road. Can gaurantee I will not speed there anymore....so it seemed like it worked.

Superkirby
08-22-2012, 09:05 AM
A buddy and I just had a conversation similar to this.

A person goes over the speed limit 5 or more mph. Is it really that big of a deal? Not necessarily. At the same time said person knows they're going over the speed limit, and everyone knows if you're speeding, you run the risk of getting caught which comes with some form of consequence. But at the same time it's speeding, really not the end of the world, unless everyone was doing it and then it could lead to some problems.
So really what options do they have? They have to do something with a negative consequence. If everyone that was caught speeding was forced to eat 3 cookies, speeding would be awesome. But it has to be pretty minor, and ultimately they give you a choice. Which is more valuable to you - money or time? In your case and the case of 8 others, it was money. Everyone else was time.

Mudderoy
08-22-2012, 09:15 AM
Just so everyone is clear I understand the concept of punishment and reward, however my point wasn't that I was speeding and got away with it, it was how the legal system works, at least worked for me and others in that court yesterday.

If a police officer is on his patrol and observes someone breaking the law he must decide if it is something that needs to be dealt with. If he sees a speeder going well above the limit and putting other people in danger by doing so he/she should pull over and give that person a citation. It removes danger from the public and hopefully it tells the aggressive driver that there will be punishment for their actions.

Also if an officer sees someone driving 5 or 10 miles below the speed limit they must determine if this is dangerous to the public and react accordingly. Setting up a speed trap with the express goal to write a bunch of tickets and NOT making a determination of what is or isn't safe is my issue.

Furthermore running these same people through a money grinder isn't right. This isn't law enforcement, it's revenue generation and I highly suspect the police officers didn't see this as what fighting crime was all about when they joined the force.

I am NOT saying police should not patrol, pull people over and write tickets, they should, but they should be given the respect by the people over them to let them deal with criminals by using their own judgement.

DETOURS
08-22-2012, 07:51 PM
I personally know of one state, that actually projects a state reveniew (spell) number per quarter on traffic violations.......I'm sure most states do as well.....you just got caught in the wheel of dollars...

Dosent mean you should continue to speed........BWAAAHAAHAAAAA, I ment, dosent mean you should continue to be CAUGHT!..:rotfl2:

UpstateXJ
08-22-2012, 08:15 PM
I have had my fair share of tickets that I have paid. I still have a heavy right foot too. I have also been going the speed limit and given a too fast for conditions ticket that I faught and won! If the speed limit is 55 and I am doing it, mind your own business. A buddy of mine that had a VERY lifted truck actaully had the laws pertaining to his truck on a laminated sheet in the glove box. Cops would hassel him and he would educate them on the law and how his truck was still legal.

It is a big game to see who will flinch first...sad part is, most of the time it is the little guy.

Firemanray
08-22-2012, 09:00 PM
I speed 'till I get caught. I plead out, take deferred adjudication for 90 days, be a good little boy for 90 days then go at it again. ( I only get stopped about every 3 years so I must not really be that bad.):D

Truth of the matter is I pay the full fine every time. I pay court costs to keep it off my record. They get their revenue I keep my clean record. Win, win.


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