Upgrading rear bumper JCR,ProtoFab,Wilderness help me decide

[weaselguys]

I want to upgrade my rear bumper it has to have a tire carrier & fuel can rack and I would prefer a contoured bumper to better match the body. Any personal experience with any of these or other idea would be a help . Here is what I'm looking at.

JCR Crusader Deluxe

http://thumb10.webshots.net/t/81/81/0/97/80/2584097800105708590NUTzSI_th.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2584097800105708590NUTzSI)

http://thumb10.webshots.net/t/87/187/5/87/46/2204587460105708590fYjnmX_th.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2204587460105708590fYjnmX)

I like the contour of the bumper , I'm not sure about the roto pax cans they are spendy and small , I could add more of them to this bumper . I emailed JCR from their web site with questions and got a auto response saying thy would contact me and have not heard from them (not a good start)

Proto Fab Rock Solid Bumper w/tire carrier

http://thumb10.webshots.net/t/81/81/6/61/95/2825661950105708590EbzGum_th.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2825661950105708590EbzGum)

and their fuel can carrier

http://thumb10.webshots.net/t/87/187/1/22/96/2452122960105708590AuLuPA_th.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2452122960105708590AuLuPA)

I'm not sure I like the hiem joints , Mike at Proto Fab was quick with responses.

Wilderness Rack

http://thumb10.webshots.net/t/81/81/8/39/86/2693839860105708590YhChSp_th.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2693839860105708590YhChSp)

with add on corner cover from Rocky Road Outfitters

http://thumb10.webshots.net/t/87/187/1/43/90/2374143900105708590neKmGR_th.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2374143900105708590neKmGR)

I'm not sure if I would be happy with the corners or the flat plain bumper , but I like the rack and its options.

[4.3LXJ]

Well, one thing about the Wilderness rack is that it covers all the bases

[bigjim350]

Ive always liked JCR's bumpers

[XJ Wheeler]

I personally like the JCR bumper better. So i would get that and modify the rack to my likin', and since JCRs stuff comes bare you wouldn't be messin up the finish.

[weaselguys]

I like the JCR's look ,the roto packs are small 2 gal ea so I would have to add 2 3 gal ones to get my target of 10 that's another $120 + .What I don't like about it the most is the D ring mount are only welded on not a thru the bumper design.

[Mudderoy]

I like the JCR's look ,the roto packs are small 2 gal ea so I would have to add 2 3 gal ones to get my target of 10 that's another $120 + .What I don't like about it the most is the D ring mount are only welded on not a thru the bumper design.

I'm surprised JCR would build it that way, :wow: I don't blame you, I wouldn't like welded to the surface either.

[xj4life2]

I'm surprised JCR would build it that way, :wow: I don't blame you, I wouldn't like welded to the surface either.

Not to be a nay sayer but we weld them to the face all the time and have never had an issue at all. So personally I wouldn't let that stop me.

[Mudderoy]

Not to be a nay sayer but we weld them to the face all the time and have never had an issue at all. So personally I wouldn't let that stop me.

Good to know. :thanx:

[4.3LXJ]

Not to be a nay sayer but we weld them to the face all the time and have never had an issue at all. So personally I wouldn't let that stop me.

My take on that is that if you are using something like say 3/16" material, it is stronger than what you bolt to in the rear.

[EekGirl96]

Im pretty sure that with whatever you look at there will be something that doesnt fit your needs. I say you buy the one thats the closest to what your looking for and them modify it till its perfect and up to your standards

[xj4life2]

My take on that is that if you are using something like say 3/16" material, it is stronger than what you bolt to in the rear.

Thats why you use a nut strip to tie into the uni body in the rear. they also tie into the trailer hitch if you have one. Pulled a lifted f250 out of the snow with no issues at all.

[bluedragon436]

Well I'm going to have to say out of the choices given I would go with the JCR option... But have you looked at AJ's Offroad Armor's Tanker/Carrier (http://www.ajsoffroadarmor.com/product.php?productid=17582&cat=254&page=1) setup?? Figure it has the D-ring tabs welded all the way through, has a trailer hitch, tire carrier, high lift jack mount, and has the choice of one or dual full size Jerry can mounts... And they are on sale right now for a pretty reasonable price... Just another option, wasn't sure if you had seen that one or not... But that one would def. get my vote... it is even setup for protection after doing the cut-n-fold to the lower rear quarters!!

http://www.ajsoffroadarmor.com/images/P/Bumper%20finished%20020.jpg

[JcrOffroad]

What I don't like about it the most is the D ring mount are only welded on not a thru the bumper design.

All of our drings are welded front and back on our bumpers. The dring tabs are also welded to the bumper mounts themselves also. Here is a picture of the front bumper, but the rear is the same way:

http://www.jcroffroad.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/XJ-F-Deluxe5.jpg

[Mudderoy]

All of our drings are welded front and back on our bumpers. The dring tabs are also welded to the bumper mounts themselves also. Here is a picture of the front bumper, but the rear is the same way:

http://www.jcroffroad.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/XJ-F-Deluxe5.jpg

Great pictures, thanks!

It may be fine to surface weld things, but this kind of attachment makes me feel much better.

[bluedragon436]

All of our drings are welded front and back on our bumpers. The dring tabs are also welded to the bumper mounts themselves also. Here is a picture of the front bumper, but the rear is the same way:

http://www.jcroffroad.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/XJ-F-Deluxe5.jpg

I thought I remembered seeing those pics before, just couldn't find them to verify what I was remembering...

[weaselguys]

bluedragon436 yes I did look at AJ's Tanker it looks great on a cut & fold, it wouldn't look as good w/o it.I did send them a email for there site about doing on w/o the cut & fold option but have never heard back form them.

[weaselguys]

jcrOffroad that you for responding with the pics of the tabs that is better than I thought.Now maybe you will help me with a few questions I asked on of them from the contact form on your web site and never got a response.What is your current lead time ? Can you tell me the size hole you put in the bumper for your backup light option (I want the hole but plan on using push in lights -easier to change) ? Also I'm thiking of adding more rotopaks mounts on each side of the tire to be able to add more containers ,what do you think ?

[JcrOffroad]

What is your current lead time ?

12-15 days at the moment. Usually on the lower end of our estimates.


Can you tell me the size hole you put in the bumper for your backup light option (I want the hole but plan on using push in lights -easier to change) ?

We use 3.2" diameter lights, the holes are somewhere near 3.5" round. The problem you will run into is that the light cut out has a bend in it:

http://www.jcroffroad.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/XJ-Standard2.jpg


Also I'm thiking of adding more rotopaks mounts on each side of the tire to be able to add more containers ,what do you think ?

You probably won't be able to just add more spacer between the tire and the carrier to mount larger cans all that easily. It would require some fabricating to that.

Why are you set on 10 gallons of fuel? Are you planning on doing expedition type wheeling? Let's say this: Worst case, you get 10mpg on the trail. You have 4 gallons of fuel, that will carry you 40 miles. That's a lot of trail miles. Carrying 10 gallons of fuel is 80 pounds of extra weight as well.

[weaselguys]

I camp in the Big Horn Mtns in Wyoming alot I always fuel right before entering the mtns but with towing a camper by the time I get to camp I usually only have enough fuel for I day of wheeling and then I'm done for the trip or I have to go out to get fuel. If I added 2 more can mounts I could carry your std 4 gals + maybe I of the new 3 gal for 7 gal and then maybe a gal or 2 of water or a gal of oil ,that would add many possibilites. As far as the extra weight I plan on beefing up my spring pack for towing my trailer this year anyway. So I take it you don't think push in lights would work ? I plan to keep my hitch even if that means notching the bumper so I figured the hitch would block access to the lights from behind.

[weaselguys]

I am also trying 2 fabrication shops for a custom build and have talked to 2 places making bumpers about modifying theirs. I am surprised by the response so far from fab shops building $800 bumpers not wanting to modify theirs to what I wanting the $1500 range to much effort or not wanting to take the time I guess.

[4.3LXJ]

Custom fab is expensive in shops. Be better to buy a keg and donate it to someone who can weld.

[Mudderoy]

I am also trying 2 fabrication shops for a custom build and have talked to 2 places making bumpers about modifying theirs. I am surprised by the response so far from fab shops building $800 bumpers not wanting to modify theirs to what I wanting the $1500 range to much effort or not wanting to take the time I guess.

I bet I talked to Mark "DETOURS" for a couple of months before he agreed to build my completely custom front bumper. Recently he built a second one. :rotfl2:

[prcjeep]

I personally like the JCR bumper better. So i would get that and modify the rack to my likin', and since JCRs stuff comes bare you wouldn't be messin up the finish.

One thing I know about JCR is that if you do any modifications to their product, any warrantee you had is void. I have one of their products... low profile roof rack and i love it except that they never responded to an inquiry about clearance issues with the roof... it touches and it shouldnt, they told me to bend the mounting brackets a tad bit to see if would help and that was a no go. Now I havent heard back from them since March. Also, give them about 4 weeks from order placement to delivery.

[weaselguys]

I tried Mark at Detours about modifying his rear bumper to what I wanted ,but he said he couldn't do it.

[weaselguys]

Mudd you can stop this poll if you want as it is no longer needed because A CUSTOM WE ARE GOING!!! Chris at BDC Fabrications in Oregon has agreed to build me a custom rear bumper .It will be contoured similar to the JCR have push in style back up lights ,centered tire mount that is adjustable , D-ring tabs ,spindle mount , 2 jerry can holders behind the tire ,hi lift jack mount and a removable over the tire rack like the wilderness bumpers. AWESOME.......:D:D

[Mudderoy]

Mudd you can stop this poll if you want as it is no longer needed because A CUSTOM WE ARE GOING!!! Chris at BDC Fabrications in Oregon has agreed to build me a custom rear bumper .It will be contoured similar to the JCR have push in style back up lights ,centered tire mount that is adjustable , D-ring tabs ,spindle mount , 2 jerry can holders behind the tire ,hi lift jack mount and a removable over the tire rack like the wilderness bumpers. AWESOME.......:D:D

It's cool, no probs, but please keep us updated on the bumper. Sounds nice.

Well when I spoke with Mark about the first bumper I got from him I asked him about adding a hi-lift mount and a place to mount a jerry can. He said no to the jerry can, and hell no to the hi-lift. "hi-lifts are dangerous enough if you keep them INSIDE the Jeep!" he said. lol

Yeah so there are things that Mark won't do. :D

[bluedragon436]

I think it is awesome customer service to have JCR Offroad responding to your questions like they are... That should def. help you make that choice... at least it would for me... Then again I was already partial to the JCR setups.. After checking out AJ's offroad's site that I wanted to order some other parts from... I figured out the reason why you haven't gotten any answer from them, is apparently they are shutting down/looking for new ownership to take over the company..

[Mountain Goat]

This is posted on AJ's site:


AJ's Offroad Armor is under new ownership, please bear with us as we make the transition. The new owners have the time and space to expand with a lot of new ideas and products. Existing products will still be available!
Feel free to give us a call at 563-425-4599


I run a modified Slick Rock on the front and a Tanker on the rear. They are GREAT bumpers and AJ is a nice guy, but it did take a lot longer than quoted to receive the finished product. In the end it was well worth the wait.


.

[Mudderoy]

This is posted on AJ's site:


AJ's Offroad Armor is under new ownership, please bear with us as we make the transition. The new owners have the time and space to expand with a lot of new ideas and products. Existing products will still be available!
Feel free to give us a call at 563-425-4599


I run a modified Slick Rock on the front and a Tanker on the rear. They are GREAT bumpers and AJ is a nice guy, but it did take a lot longer than quoted to receive the finished product. In the end it was well worth the wait.


.

Yeah I don't know if you read his post here (or on the other sites) but he was selling due to health issues. Sure hate to hear that. I hope he stays in touch and lets us know how he's doing.

[xj4life2]

Very sad to here , his stuff rocked , I sure hope the new owners keep the same service,quality and product. Time will tell.

[weaselguys]

Well I have been waiting over a year now for my new bumper from a fab shop , it's been a very big hassle I should have just bought the JCR.

[Mudderoy]

Well I have been waiting over a year now for my new bumper from a fab shop , it's been a very big hassle I should have just bought the JCR.

holy crap! Over a year! You could have printed one by now! :smiley-laughing021:

[TimmyTXJ]

Is it being made of pure unobtanium? You have the patience of a saint my friend! Is there no way to cut your losses, recoup whatever money you can and move on to that JCR bumper?

[4.3LXJ]

I would do that. A year is ridiculous. If you used a credit card, the bank can get it back for you

[weaselguys]

No I sent the man a $1500 check so it is gone I trusted him because I had bought from him before and he was a jeep forum guy. I'm waiting till the end of the month that's all of the time I'm giving him.

[TimmyTXJ]

No I sent the man a $1500 check so it is gone I trusted him because I had bought from him before and he was a jeep forum guy. I'm waiting till the end of the month that's all of the time I'm giving him.

Fingers crossed the guy makes good.
If he doesn't, I'd request delivery of what he's done and get some beer & pizza, find a friend with a welder and knock that sucker outta the park!

[weaselguys]

I may ask him to do that anything is better than nothing.

[JcrOffroad]

The plot thickens...

http://www.cherokeeforum.com/f67/new-rear-bumper-jcr-protofab-wilderness-help-me-decide-135615/index5/

[Mudderoy]

The plot thickens...

http://www.cherokeeforum.com/f67/new-rear-bumper-jcr-protofab-wilderness-help-me-decide-135615/index5/

Wow! Interesting read. I think my name is worth more than $300, especially if you know how to weld. Of course I didn't see the bumper's welds, maybe they're crap. Sad sad sad.

[Dredwolf]

The plot thickens...

http://www.cherokeeforum.com/f67/new-rear-bumper-jcr-protofab-wilderness-help-me-decide-135615/index5/

Oh good grief.......seriously?

I have been looking at the JCR DIY kits for a long time now, rear bumper is next ones the suspension is done.

[kxraptor]

Being a fab guy,,it gags me to think of paying someone that much for a bumper

[Dredwolf]

Being a fab guy,,it gags me to think of paying someone that much for a bumper

No kidding, he could have subbed the work out to another fabricator for that much...

[weaselguys]

Well I gave the man every chance to make it right and said he had no more time after yesterday , so here it is plain as day , beware of doing business with BDC Fabrications in Portland Ore. Chris there I guess doesn't care about his reputation I have been ripped off for $1500 by him.

[bluedragon436]

Sorry to hear about you getting completely ripped off... I would def get up with the BBB and see if you can file a complaint through them about him, also woudl talk to you bank, I know some will still allow you to recoop some money even if you use a check, can't hurt to see what they say... That is why I'm always a little leary with going with a "lowlevel" company or person who fabs up stuff... I have been looking at JCR for my bumpers/sliders since I found them.. can't wait to be able to save up the money for them... Hope you are able to get somethign back out of this deal...

[Brasscatz]

It's really sad when stuff like this happens. I just don't know how people live with themselves

[Mudderoy]

Well I gave the man every chance to make it right and said he had no more time after yesterday , so here it is plain as day , beware of doing business with BDC Fabrications in Portland Ore. Chris there I guess doesn't care about his reputation I have been ripped off for $1500 by him.

Well things happen, health, death in the family, DWI, etc... but where's the money? They should at least have something to tell you about the $1,500 and when you'll be getting it back.

[weaselguys]

The BBB I didn't think of that one I will have to try it.

[OrangeXJ]

One more option is contact there local law inforcement and see if they will file theft charges.

[weaselguys]

Well I filed a complaint with the BBB and mudderoy you are right things happen , so far I have heard at least 3 stories from him about why it was taking so long and I was patient with him through all of them.

[Mudderoy]

Well I filed a complaint with the BBB and mudderoy you are right things happen , so far I have heard at least 3 stories from him about why it was taking so long and I was patient with him through all of them.

Well good. I wish I had thought of the BBB report. I did send him an e-mail telling him about this post. I like to give vendors (even if they are not vendors here) a chance to defend themselves, or maybe do the right thing and refund the money. Not everyone has $1500 laying around so maybe just a promise to pay, you know something that addresses the unfair situation.

I didn't hear back, but the point was just to inform and give them a chance to respond to the post.

[Brasscatz]

$1,500 is a lot of money to me.... Even at $100 I'd be raising hell to get my money back or a finished product possibly at a discount. I think he's already spent the money, so you're probably not getting THAT back, but he should at least follow through on the bumper. If not, that's theft and I believe it's a felony over $500....
Do you have a lawyer that is a family friend or even a relative? Might talk to them if so. Even if you get $500 back, it's much better than nothing at all.

[weaselguys]

I did at least fiend someone on a forum that knew him they said they went and talked to him and I got 3 more reasons from him why I have not been contacted or why the bumpers not going to be done and I was told that he would be contacting me (nothing yet)

[Mudderoy]

I did at least fiend someone on a forum that knew him they said they went and talked to him and I got 3 more reasons from him why I have not been contacted or why the bumpers not going to be done and I was told that he would be contacting me (nothing yet)

wow a face to face and nothing. So much for honesty and character.

[weaselguys]

I finally got a email from him he said he will get me paid back some how , I told him he could make payments if nothing else , we will see if I hear back from him with money in the near future.

[4.3LXJ]

Get you paid back? Did he ever even have the skills to make the thing in the first place?

[NW99XJ]

I sincerely hope he follows thru with this.
Regardless of what happens in life, thats just bad business.
Good luck man. I hope this all gets worked out in the end.

[bluedragon436]

I hope he either gets you the money owned, or the bumper you ordered, and that thing better be amazing!! Now one thing I will say is, even if you the bumpers, enjoy the bumper and maybe even make a thread about how good the bumper is... but I would def not give a prop on his customer service or anything else for that matter... so that no one else will be stuck in your situation..

[weaselguys]

I offered him payments and even to stop the posts , but I guess he doesn't want a time limit on when he has to pay me back because once again he won't answer my emails.